Making the Right Call: Shared Skills Between Officiating and Claims

Danette Beck (00:00):
Welcome everyone. We're back with the Astrus Advantage podcast. I'm Danette Beck, and I'm here on behalf of Astrus Insurance Solutions where we've spent the last 10 years focused solely on the construction industry. At Astrus, we're bringing together underwriting, claims, risk engineering and data to help contractors stay protected and keep projects moving. We've launched this podcast to shine a light on the real issues facing contractors, brokers and our risk professionals today. From rising insurance costs and workforce challenges to evolving job site exposures and litigation trends, there's no shortage of complexity in construction, and we believe the more visibility we can provide, the better decisions the industry can make. Our goal is to share insights, elevate conversations and help our partners navigate risk with clarity and confidence. We have a very special guest with us today because we're going to highlight our claims expertise, and with us we have our head of workers' compensation claims, Jeff Heaser. Jeff, welcome to the podcast.

Jeff Heaser (00:53):
Thank you. Appreciate the opportunity here.

Danette Beck (00:55):
The reason why we have a very special guest in Jeff is that Jeff actually moonlights as an SEC football referee. We're going to talk a little bit about what he's learned on and off the field and how it's helped him from a claims perspective. To start, Jeff, what got you into reffing in the first place?

Jeff Heaser (01:14):
Yes, thank you, Danette. Honestly, I grew up playing sports. I love the competitive nature of the sports. Through my high school years I played three different sports and one of them happened to be football, but honestly I only played one year of that and I hated it. That's funny to say that. But in the end, I just love the sports in general, but football was always one of my loves. I had a neighbor of mine that was a basketball official, and next thing you know he was coaching me, he was taking me to basketball games and one thing led to another that not only from the basketball world, he introduced me to some football friends and that opened the door to myself getting into football officiating. It was just my way of staying with the game. It's a sport, like I said, I've always enjoyed and I've loved.

Danette Beck (01:55):
That's amazing Jeff. So tell me, how did you get into insurance? Because I know that that was your first career before getting into the ref side.

Jeff Heaser (02:02):
Yes, thank you. Honestly, I hate to say it the cliché wise, no one ever thinks they're getting into the insurance world.

Danette Beck (02:06):
Hey, hey, hey.

Jeff Heaser (02:07):
I know.

Danette Beck (02:08):
You know I did.

Jeff Heaser (02:08):
Well, okay, you were the opposite. But the funny thing was, my actual first career was, and I jokingly say this, this is where I learned my stripes. I actually worked for retail, I worked for the company called Foot Locker. I say that because that's what opened the door to management, to moving things forward, problem solving, all this stuff. When I realized that wasn't what I wanted to do, those qualities carried over to a recruiter, which got me into the insurance world. That's how I got there.

Danette Beck (02:35):
Awesome. Okay. I have to ask, I know probably what the answer's going to be, but do you have any favorite teams? I know I can't convince you to say Georgia or the Georgia Bulldogs, but any favorite teams or maybe even a favorite game that you refereed?

Jeff Heaser (02:49):
Yes, you're right. There is no favorite team. I jokingly, I can say my favorite team is the place where I went to school, Northern Illinois University. That's really the only team that I have a favor to. I've always enjoyed watching the Huskies. We're more of a mid-major. We're nowhere near the powerhouse of the University of Georgia or any of these Power 4, Power 5 conferences. But we just have to be fair and impartial. I have no alliance to any one specific team. As it relates to your second question, is there a favorite game, favorite scenario, favorite story? For me, anytime I get to go to a new stadium, I love seeing the culture. I love seeing the fan, I love to see what takes place behind the scenes. But if there is one game that would stick out and the story I would share with you, and that is probably the best game ever in my life, would be the Army-Navy game. I've been fortunate enough to do it twice and in two different positions. One being what is called a field judge and then the second one was as a referee. In that second game, my family, my dad was actually there, and I didn't know it at the time, but he sees me working, I'm on this jumbo screen and my wife is sitting next to him and they're showing the coin toss on this jumbotron. I come to find out later, my dad was crying.

Danette Beck (03:55):
That's awesome.

Jeff Heaser (03:55):
My parents have instilled all this to where I am now, and that's always meant the most to me. Anytime I can get family to come to a game, I've always enjoyed that.

Danette Beck (04:04):
I love that, Jeff. So tell me, what skills do you use in both insurance and then on the grid iron? Are there any skills that you have to use in both roles?

Jeff Heaser (04:15):
Yes, good question. I think it's amazing how much it overlaps between both roles whether I'm in the insurance world or I'm on the field. Decision-making under pressure is always a must. We have to be very clear in our communication. In the insurance world, you've probably done a lot of homework to get to that point to make the best possible outcome for the decision we've got coming here, but on the field you don't have time. You've got to trust your peers, you've got to trust what's going on around you to know that you're getting the quality information, clear communication so that you can present the answer of where we need to go next to resolve whatever's going on. That resolution plays a role in both the insurer's world and out on the field. I think lastly would be conflict resolution. We're in a field where in the insurance world and on the field, things go wrong all the time, and your job is to mitigate these issues, diffuse the situation and bring it to a resolution. I'd like to think that we get this right the first time, but we'd make our mistakes, but you have to learn from those mistakes. When things do happen, you got to remain calm, state your position, be strong, be confident and be able to move on.

Danette Beck (05:16):
Does engagement in each of these different spaces differ or do you find that there's a lot of similarities?

Jeff Heaser (05:22):
I think there's a lot of similarities. I would even add a third part of our roles as family members, you're managing children, you're managing the family, you're managing what's going on in the house, that's one. With football officiating, you're managing coaches, you're managing players, and in some respects you're even managing fellow officials. Sometimes things happen during the week and you've got to keep that separate from what's going to happen on the game, so you got to keep everybody focused. But when in the insurance world, you're getting a wealth of information, and sometimes in the work comp world, you've got to apply, as we say in the work comp world, the statutes, you got to apply what is right. When someone gets hurt, we're going to pay for what's right. If something's wrong, then we're going to look at what was wrong and we got to figure out how do we fix this.

Danette Beck (06:01):
I know you mentioned having your family at the game and that being a core memory for you. Can you call on any major accomplishment for each side, both in the claim side or an accomplishment on the field that you also call on?

Jeff Heaser (06:16):
In the insurance world, anytime you roll out a new program, it takes time to put all the prep work to get everybody in line, whether it's telephone calls, whether it's meetings, zoom calls. Once you outline everything that needs to be done and then you implement it, the reward at the end to see this carry over to claims handling and mitigating claims or for our clients saving money is very rewarding. So we're always trying to find those different programs, these different vendors. There's different statutes that say, hey, how can we mitigate these claims to bring the best resolution and make it a win-win for everybody.

Danette Beck (06:53):
It's not really a big accomplishment, but small incremental ones that are consistent.

Jeff Heaser (06:58):
Yes, that's a fair statement. I think we all take little wins, honestly. In the insurance world and I'll say the same thing on the football field, we take little wins for getting to that next game. Every game we consider is the biggest game ever. One day you might be doing a high school game and then you get promoted to the next level for small college, then you get to Division 1 college or have the opportunity to work in the professional level. Those are small wins each time to get to that next level. But in each one of those levels, in the football world we strive for post-season assignment, so those were always very rewarding. I always take the biggest reward, and I say it this way, my biggest goal for every crew on a football field, I always say the eight of us that are on the football field are one. My goal at the beginning of the year is to tell them, we're going to do everything we can as a crew that all eight of us get a post-season assignment. That’s not easy to do, but when it does happen, I will say, although they're small wins each week, but when it comes to the end, for me it's a very big reward when everyone does get a post-season assignment.

Danette Beck (07:57):
Jeff, when you get assigned to a crew, do you keep that crew for the entire season?

Jeff Heaser (08:02):
For the most part, barring any conflicts. For example, if like I said before in the beginning, I could never do a game at Northern Illinois University.

Danette Beck (08:08):
Oh.

Jeff Heaser (08:09):
If any official has an affiliation with the school, where they went there or they have a business relationship or their family members go there, no one ever wants to have that opportunity cause a conflict. You don't want that. Fans can figure that stuff out, and then you don't want that to come back to hurt you in the long run.

Danette Beck (08:24):
Sure, sure, sure. Well, I have a favorite memory. Every time I see you on TV, we have a game that we do at home where it's like find Jeff, and so we'll go through all the games to see which ones you're reffing for that weekend. It's always a lot of fun to see you down there on the field. Alright, so let's speak about the field, and both the claims field and on the football field is that both jobs can be pretty strict with little to no room for mistakes. How does this pressure, and we talk a lot about pressure as a privilege, but how does that affect choices that you make and your decision-making process?

Jeff Heaser (08:56):
Yes, good question. A couple things. Preparation goes a long way. The preparation that you put into and the process minimizes those mistakes. I think in both worlds you have to accept you can't be perfect, but you know you're going to be held accountable. You can't be afraid to say you've made a mistake. I think both jobs can humble you. You have to learn from your errors. You have to learn from them quickly. We can't make those same mistakes twice, otherwise you wouldn't be doing this for long. I'll just say this, knowing there's little margin for error forces me to prepare relentlessly. Whether that's reviewing game film or studying claim files. When mistakes happen, you own it, you fix it and then you learn from it immediately.

Danette Beck (09:34):
I was going to ask you about the fixing part of it. Because these are, I think both within claims and then also on the field decisions, those are split second decisions. So if something's challenged, what does that process look like that you go through in order to rectify it right away?

Jeff Heaser (09:49):
I guess in the insurance world, sometimes we're tied into meetings and if someone's challenging you and you felt like you've presented it very well, you may have a coworker with you and you may go to them to confirm what you've said. Or these are trusted people that you've worked with for a long time, and they can help reinforce that point. It might be just a clarity situation, but I think when you surround yourself with good people, it only helps you in the end get the best possible outcome.

Danette Beck (10:15):
A lot about team and team orientation here at Astrus. I can see that that also balances it out to where you can turn to your colleagues and we all work together to support each other on challenging situations like that.

Jeff Heaser (10:28):
Totally. Even in the football worlds, there's only eight of us on the field. There's eight different angles, and sometimes watching it from above as a fan, you only get one angle, but if you're watching it on TV, you have the luxury of up to potentially 30 camera angles, and we may not see every angle. I try to take pride on the field, we try to talk through it during our pregame, part of our preparation. I like to think that we have two or three angles on every play and two or three different sets of eyes, so I want to make sure we get it right. We take our time. It seems seamless on the field, but we go through a lot of preparation to get to that point, whether it be crew scrimmages, whether it be video. We just want to make sure we do what we can to get it right. There can be situations where there's a rule interpretation and you know the guys on the field who might be one more of an expert in a certain position or a certain play that maybe you can count on. It’s just like in the insurance world, you've got a trusted advocate to help you in case something goes wrong in the heat of the moment.

Danette Beck (11:26):
It's all about perspective, right? That's a good word that came to mind as you were answering.

Jeff Heaser (11:31):
Yes, very clear. Thank you.

Danette Beck (11:32):
Jeff, let me ask you this. It seems like you've got like nine lives to be able to do both of these jobs. How do you find the balance?

Jeff Heaser (11:40):
That's always a big question, and I'm not going to disagree. There is a big balance that needs to take place and time management and prioritizations are the two keys. Insurance is year-round, football is becoming year-round. It's a matter of, like I said, you've got to manage your time.

Danette Beck (11:58):
Alright, final question that I have for you today is, do you need to shift your focus when going between jobs? If so, what is your mental process for when you go from one to the other?

Jeff Heaser (12:13):
Yes, you definitely got to be able to switch. You definitely got to have the ability to shift your focus between roles. As an example, what I do typically on a game on a Saturday, I typically take the first flight out Friday morning, and then I'll work from the hotel. But what happens is when we shift to football starting Friday night, usually one of the first things I make the comment to the crew is, alright gentlemen, we now have to shift the focus. I'm saying it just point blank, goes like, I need to take you away from your family, I need to take you away from your work week, let's get into football. Literally I bring out the video to shift the gears, and I keep that ritual and it's almost changed that mindset. That takes place from Friday night when we start our meetings, Saturday preparation before the game, the game itself, post-game and then everybody goes home Sunday and we shift gears back to our normal lives, whether it's family or our work week. It is a mental reset. You have to take the time to do it. Some of that is shifting gears to the rule book in a football world or switching to an open claim in the insurance world and revisiting what is the action plan to get this thing to be resolved.

Danette Beck (13:17):
Well Jeff, I know for a fact that all of us here at Astrus are proud of what you do for our claims team, for our clients, and we're also proud of you representing not only Astrus, but your family and yourself as you are reffing out on the football field and couldn't be more excited to highlight one of our team members on our podcast. The title that I came up with this was "Making the Right Call: Shared Skills Between Officiating and Claims," and boy did you prove that today. Thank you so much for your insight, and we look forward to hosting our next podcast and highlighting additional team members and also bringing you other opportunities to learn more about the construction industry and the risks that we face today. Thank you everyone for tuning in, and we will talk to you next time.